Go Ask Mother: Advice About Going Back To School

7Dec2011 Author: Mother Jones, RN

This lady and I have a lot in common. We both answer a lot of correspondence. For instance, I just received an email from a reader who was really upset. I changed her name for the post to protect her identity. This is what she wrote:

Dear Mother:
My name is Sandy, I’ve been an RN for.. I don’t know, 15 years or so. I have an AD, and absolutely NO desire to obtain my BSN. (sounds like the opening line of an aa meeting, lol) I’m writing to see if you could help me find info, or send me in the right direction to find it. The hospital I currently work for has decided to implement an all BSN RN staff by 2018. The catch is, they are requiring ALL CURRENT employees, with a diploma or AD, to obtain a BSN to KEEP the jobs we already have. I’m a non benefited employee, so.. they have to pay nothing to help me obtain this degree they mandate. I’m beyond frustrated, and a little more than angry…. ANY advice, info, suggestions would be very appreciated. Thanks so much!!!

I had to give some thought before I could answer her question. I identify with her frustration. Honestly, I’m really sick and tired of the way bedside nurses are being treated by the nursing elite, AKA “Nursing Leaders.” Please insert eye roll. I can’t stand people who mandate higher education while they treat bedside nurses like the redheaded stepchildren of nursing academia, but I digress. Sandy asked a heartfelt questions and I wanted to answer it to the best of my ability. I answered her question later that evening after I bridled my emotions.

I wrote this response:

Hi Sandy. Thanks for writing. I’m really sorry about what’s happening to you and your coworkers. This is why I weep for our profession. It’s run by nursing administrators that don’t have a clue about what it takes to work as a bedside nurse.

As you know, the ANA is pushing for nurses like us go back to school. I’m sure that’s why your hospital has made this demand on its nurses. However, college is expensive and you have to ask yourself if you will be able to earn back the money you put out for tution by the time you retire. I have friends who owe over $100,000 in college loans because they felt pressured to get an advance degree and they won’t ever be able to pay off their debt before they reach retirement age. It also depends on what you want to do during your career. Some jobs require a degree. For example, you need a degree if you want to teach someday, or if you want to become a nurse practitioner.

I think your hospital is being very short sighted. The nursing market is glutted right now, but that won’t last forever. Older nurses are postponing retirement because of the economy, but we Golden Girls can’t work forever, and we won’t be coming back to the profession once we retire. The US Labor Department is predicting the mother of all nursing shortages by 2020, so let your hospital be stupid. I’m sure you will be able to find work somewhere else if they show you the door.

Well, that’s it for my advice. I hope you don’t mind if I share my answer with the rest of my readers.

Best, Mother Jones, RN

I’m sure that not everyone will agree with my advice and that’s all right. The last time I looked, we still live in a democracy, so it’s OK if you have a different opinion. But please, don’t discount the opinions of AD and diploma nurses just because we don’t have an advance degree. We know what’s going on in the trenches because we are bedside nurses. We don’t live in the Nursing Ivory Tower.

Tags: ANA, Continuing education, mandates, nursing, nursing education, nursing school

17 Responses to “Go Ask Mother: Advice About Going Back To School”

The Mental
December 7th, 2011 at 4:15 pm
I applaud your response to this nurse. In the background, please hear a standing ovation with shouts of Bravo! in Carnegie Hall! I worked in nursing education as support staff for 10 years and I saw too much and heard too much. I am also a patient for far too many years. I am also very opinionated regarding nurses, nursing, and healthcare. (Don’t get me started though on the organized crime AKA health insurance or HMOs, etc etc.)

I was involved in recruiting AD and diploma nurses at a local hospital to “convert” their degrees and education into a BSN. I won’t get into details but the conversations I had with these folks almost broke my heart. I advised many of them to just leave their current employer and find another job at another hospital in the city. Now here was the reason why the administrators wanted their RNs to be BSNs: it had to be that way in order for the hospital to obtain “magnet” status. I guess that would be another notch in their administrator belt to get that.

As a patient, a RN is a RN. If the state licensing boards give the designation of RN to whoever passes the NCLEX-RN–regardless of whether it is a AD or a BSN then why do the widget masters in administration care? I know, I know. I answered my own question above. Sigh. Mother Jones, RN, please stop the world because I WANT TO GET OFF!!
Ann Onymous
December 7th, 2011 at 5:44 pm
I just took an entrance exam to apply to nursing school to get my BSN.

I got a 93, and my friends and family can’t understand how I could possibly be displeased with that kind of score on a difficult test.

They don’t seem to hear me when I explain that none of last year’s applicants were accepted with anything below a 94. Or that the minimum GPA accepted was 3.85. This is for a less competitive state university. Big State University rejected all but the 4.0 students.

Most university nursing colleges have 80-100 spots, and review applications from 900-1500 students. For the 2nd degree, accelerated programs, the seat number drops down to something like 30.

My friend, who has a bachelor’s and a master’s from John’s Hopkins, a 3.6 GPA, 5 years’ work experience in medical research, and 10+ years of clinical volunteering experience, has been *wait-listed* for midwifery school. (I would like to know what she could have done differently.)

If I hear one more time about “the current nursing shortage,” I am going to jump off a building and light myself on fire on the way down.

Just where do these “Nursing Leaders” suppose we are going to get our BSNs? Online schools? Walmart should just start keeping the damn things in stock (between the toilet paper and the napkins, perhaps?) — or else we really are going to have a nursing shortage on our hands.
The Mental
December 7th, 2011 at 7:47 pm
Dear Ann Onymous, Please apply to either the University of Texas at El Paso SON or the Texas Tech El Paso campus SON. They need additional high quality students. UTEP accepts 120 BSN students twice a year. Go for it. Check their website for details. Good luck. I think if you get $1000 in scholdarships you qualify for in-state tuition? Can’t remember. I was the academic advisor for the SON but my knowledge of requirements is likely dated even if it has only been 2 years. Please note that I am no longer an official representative of UTEP. Don’t go jumping off buildings…we do need more nurses–especially in the very near future. So…do you want to become a nurse bad enough to relocate? That is the bottom line if you are accepted here. Trust me…our standards of entering classes were not that high. But our graduates were pretty darn good entry level nurses. Most of them anyway. When I left the NCLEX pass rate was 100%.
Jacob
December 8th, 2011 at 12:43 pm
ADN Nurse here. While I fully support furthering one’s education, I don’t see any real benefit for patients being cared for by an all BSN staff. To mandate such a ridiculous policy only shows lack of ability to think for one’s self. Obviously, the administrators are letting the ANA do their thinking for them. So much for all that critical thinking ability that their advanced degree supposedly demonstrates.
JA-RN
December 8th, 2011 at 2:42 pm
I’ll add my congratulations for a well-written & thought-out response. I graduated from a diploma program in the ’60′s & just retired. The higher-up’s have been pushing for degrees since forever,but now there is more of a push because of the “magnet” stuff. To be honest, I was never impressed with degree nurses as a whole. They knew about statistics & book-knowledge,but had no clue about taking care of actual patients & needed a rather long nursing internship. To me, it would make more sense to push for certification in a particular specialty/area. That would be more meaningful & demonstrate actual knowledge. Also,how many of these employers have tuition reimbursement or a pay differential for a degree/certification?
Dr Dean
December 9th, 2011 at 6:33 pm
I enjoy working with the LPN’s on our floor, so don’t ask me why ADN’s are going into a forced extinction. And not grandfathering current employees seems to be very short-sighted.

Agree with making sure the financial payback makes sense (cents) too. Great advice!
The Nerdy Nurse
December 10th, 2011 at 8:54 pm
I disgusted that her employer is forcing their staff to gain higher education and not offering to pay for it entirely. I am a strong advocate in the constant need to gain education and improve yourself as a nurse, but I really don’t see how any employer can create a new rule without allowing the current employees to be grandfathered into the policy or agreeing to pay for all costs associated with the new change.

I do advocate that you obtain your BSN, however. I think you will find that it has far more benefits that drawbacks and the experience is enjoyable. There are many many scholarships available and many many online programs that you can do that are very cost effective. You might find your education can be entirely paid for and that you feel a little more prepared to deal with the politics of healthcare and administration after completing a bachelorette of nursing degree.

There is nothing at all wrong with an LPN or ADN degree, but there is also never anything wrong with furthering your education.
2nd Degree Nursing Student
December 10th, 2011 at 9:17 pm
As a nursing student in an accelerated B.S. to RN/ADN program, I’m curious, do hospitals favoring BSNs consider *any* bachelor’s degree with an RN or must it be a BSN?
The Mental
December 10th, 2011 at 9:42 pm
While I cannot speak for other states with any simblance of real knowledge, I can talk about higher education in Texas. An ADN degree is two years of nursing classes with some general education/science courses. A BSN is also 2 years of nursing courses. The other two years are filled with general education courses…English Composition, Humanities, History, Fine Art, Political Science, Sciences, Speech, etc. While these two years of general education courses are valuable in their own right, do they make a nurse a better nurse in regards to nursing? The only differences I saw when I advised the RN – BSN students were the need for Community Nursing, Leadership, and Research courses. Telling an ADN that they must take a year of freshman composition is cruel and unusual punishment. Can I get an Amen on that?
I really struggled with this issue of ADN versus BSN while working in higher education. My final conclusion was that it was mainly a turf battle. That is only my opinion and I am not a nurse. ALL good nurses are my heroes [heroines] regardless of their formal education. Maybe this is none of my business but I am not a complete outsider to this issue. Perhaps I dare to say what those inside will not? The faculty often found me that way…but they loved me regardless! Nursing school is hell whether it is a ADN or a BSN. Oftentimes it is a financial decision which degree a student must choose–especially when cultural factors come into play as they do in a border town that lives below the national average socio-economic standards. I’ll get off my soap box now. Thanks for reading.
The Nerdy Nurse
December 11th, 2011 at 11:09 am
The Mental – I would argue that after you’ve gotten your license, nursing school is no longer hell. My BSN bridge experience was a dream compared to the rigors of my ADN program.
The Mental
December 11th, 2011 at 11:42 am
The Nerdy Nurse–I certainly agree with you! I was referring to the initial RN education! RN to BSN nursing classes are a walk compared to the first nursing degree nursing classes! I apologize if I was not clear enough on what I was trying to say. Thank you for clarifying this point! I submit this with highest respect to all–whether we agree or not–as Mother Jones, RN mentioned in her closing remarks! Thank God and our armed forces for our freedoms to speak openly without fear of retribution!
jparadisirn
December 12th, 2011 at 12:33 am
You bring up valid points. Nurse educators have written about the gap between nursing education and the expected role of the nurse at least since I was a student. I’m all for education, however, I’m not sure job conditions for bedside nurses has kept up with the higher expectations for education, for example I still have to ask a physician if it’s okay to give my patient an acetaminophen, and serve the patient’s meals. Just saying.
Linda W.
December 12th, 2011 at 11:57 am
I have been an RN for over 11years with an AS degree. Even while i was in school the instructors were pushing everyone to get their BS. After the 2 years of sacrifices my family and i had to deal with while i was in school- the thought of 2 more years never crossed my mind. I knew i never wanted to be in administration or become an APRN. Besides, i already had a BS in allied health and am a Registered Respiratory Therapist. If my hospital ever mandated the BSRN then i would go back to being a respiratory therapist-there’s a lot less stress associated with it! What ever happened to being “grandfathered in”?
Tammy Swofford
December 23rd, 2011 at 1:02 pm
The return to a university to conquer a bridge program (ADN to BSN) must also consider in realistic manner the age of the nurse. Is a forty-five year old nurse well-served investing time and income in such a venture? Or is she better off cutting the umbilical cord and investing in a completely new career?

I have noted disproportionate aging issues and physical issues for R.N.s who remain at the bedside between ages fifty and sixty. They work…. to pay for their back surgeries, neck surgeries, carpal tunnel repair, knee injuries.

I left the field a couple years ago and it was a good decision for me. I have not regretted it.

Tammy
Missy nurse
December 25th, 2011 at 4:07 pm
If we as nurses do not standardize our education as an entry level nurse, we will never be considered professionals. Teachers and physical therapist have done the same thing, they have increased their entry level education requirement. We are cutting our own throats by not doing this. And as far as getting into nursing school goes, the problem is a doctoral prepared nursing professor makes 1/2 of what most other doctoral prepared professions do. The average age is 56.5 years of age and it is only going to get worse. There is not enough facailty to educate all who want to get into nursing.
Kris
February 6th, 2012 at 5:10 pm
I decided to go on and get my RN to BSN online because I knew certain places were going to start asking for it. At least I did it online though so I could still go to work full time while obtaining the degree. I’m glad I got it and maybe in the future I can go back and get my MSN degree (that won’t be until the distant future though).
juanita
September 15th, 2012 at 2:05 pm
Am 61yrs and the hospital is pushing for Magnet status. As the result of this they want all their nurses to get their BSN by 2020. Is it worth the time and stress for me? My grown childrens advice is NO. But am getting Magnet bullying. I need more advice and support.